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 Post subject: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2009 5:14 pm 
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The seventh issue of our Kombat Kolumns is already available for all of you to read.



This week's kolumn deals with the Sega Genesis/Mega Drive Mortal Kombat games and will sure bring a lot of nice memories to all of the old school fans.

Click here to read the seventh issue of our Kombat Kulumns. Don't forget, in two weeks the next issue comes out.

We would really love to hear your opinion on the Kombat Kolumns section. So give us some feedback and help us make the section even better.

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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2009 8:40 pm 
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Nice, but there're some important details missing for MK3...

Also I think the evaluation of the ports is too hard, you're sending them to the trash can, and let's face it... for the people who can review your kollumn, they wont really notice much difference in wich refers to the gameplay.

I think the comment for MK1 and UMK3 in particular should be more like, it's amazing how close to the arcade port this game is, and not only that... it also features some neat secrets, it's worth to give it a try; it has some of the classic bugs from the arcade version plus some others... like the infinite kollumn of Kano's, Kabal's Harakiri, Fighting after the Emperor and stuff...

Rather than condemn all MK versions excepting for the arcade ones you should point the virtues and individualities on each one of them, because the arcade is broken too you know, it's more than enought to say "But of course this version is no match for the original arcade, in terms of graphics and gamplay."

Really... the kollumns judgement should take a very different direction, after all not too many people would play old MKs, not even the arcade ones, so dismissing all versions you're doing nothing to be honest is like chopping a little bit of the MK universe.

It is good to remind it is not fare to compare those games with their arcade counterparts, take in consideration the capability of the system, and other fighting games released for that console around the time... and how many good fighters were for the console.

The comparison looks to me like: if you are gonna get ony ONE version of this MK... go for the arcade version and never look to any other version...! while you could just say: "Hey this tiny version has its fun... you can do this and that and the other...

The censored fatalities are in my opinion minimized to the point the code is needed to have real fun... and I think MK1 (gen) had 2 Fatalities for various chars...!!! it's a different point of view that might interest the fans... also the secret switches who's use have not been discovered yet... Reptile throwing a green ice blast and spear...

The way you said the difference in gameplay are also covered as "terrible" mistakes wich ruin the experience... once more I ask you to check the audience you're doing this for... to me in MK1 I could do a lot more juggles, than in the original final version of MK1.

Instead of saying it's broken, you could say it had different possibilities. After all in the arcade version Sonya had an infinite Leg Grab...! so what's the criticism about any infinites the home version might have?

People have seen your videos, and they like infinites... as for today old 2D MKs are an anecdote for most people, so they're interested in kombos, and possibilities, cool details... for example Shang Tsung could morph in Reptile in MK1... and that's cool...!

If you're gonna say Tsung can do that, you dont say: "They didn't check well their programming and Tsung can morph in a green ninja, but he doesn't do all the moves, is just a green ninja and the pallete is not accurate to the arcade version, and besides you can't control it, Tsung's AI is not good either so... bad game" :? You could say instead: "This version features an extra morph for Shang Tsung... the elusive Reptile, and you would be lucky to see him do this morph as he only does it on rare occations...!"

Other example: "Tsung's Palace is gold exclusively in this version...! remember Kano's entered the tournament because he believed that Shang Tsung's palace was made of gold..? well this version has a golden version of Tsung's palace...!"

And for UMK3 you could mention the existence of Chameleon who latter appeared in MKT, and it is accesible through codes... it is an unfinished character, but it is always good to see the origin of one of the most enigmatic characters of MK. Aparently Chameleon was planned for the domestic versions of UMK3 but canceled due to the usual reasons of time.

MK3 horrible gameplay should be mentioned, people should know they're gonna have a headache even to pull an air kick follow by Kabal's Plasma Blast... Cyrax's throw doesn't change sides with the opponent and there're alternative commands for all special moves that requires to be holding a button, for the mercy, and for all F,F or B,B moves... if you want me to, I might do a research for some of those alternative commands. The MK3 version is REALLY bad in terms of juggles because of the gravity and velocity (maybe) and that must be explained, but other aspects that make this version unique must be presented.

I think the goal should be to interest people in MK... like "Hey...! that's cool, I'm gonna give it a try" then they can download the game and play it. Not making a continuos propaganda to the arcade version while bashing every other version, specially the old ones.


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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 2:06 am 
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Thank you so much for this comment.

Hopefully more will follow.

Currently I am only playing the role of the editor of the Kombat Kolumns section, so I cannot comment some of the things you pointed out. Us, defending ourselves is so not the point here too :)

I am sure that ded_ will post a comment later today.

I can only say one thing, point taken.

There are kolumns coming that are a lot more positive and go in a completely different direction.

However, the kolumn is an article that discusses a topic seen through the eyes of the writer. That is what makes it unique and separates it from an ordinary review.

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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 2:58 am 
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Well... ded_ is a great dude and he really knows a lot about MK, no question about it... and he's right about what he sais about the arcade port being the best one.

Didn't meant to offend... maybe my post felt agressive, but it wasn't my intention, just to point out my view in hopes to help if possible... also I posted some details I didn't see in the kollumn.

Just wanted to say the kollumns might be a great chance to encourage people to experience the MK games in so many ways...!


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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 3:16 am 
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good post man, let me see whats good and not:

Quote:
Also I think the evaluation of the ports is too hard, you're sending them to the trash can, and let's face it... for the people who can review your kollumn, they wont really notice much difference in wich refers to the gameplay.


thats true, i never liked most of the ports, i should write some positive stuff here and there lol.

Quote:
I think the comment for MK1 and UMK3 in particular should be more like, it's amazing how close to the arcade port this game is, and not only that... it also features some neat secrets, it's worth to give it a try; it has some of the classic bugs from the arcade version plus some others... like the infinite kollumn of Kano's, Kabal's Harakiri, Fighting after the Emperor and stuff...


i really dont think mk1 and umk3 are close to the arcade, in anyway. gameplay is totaly different, music and sfx are bad, and etc. as for the glitches, i cant list everything, but you should check these pages:

http://www.mksecrets.net/mk1/eng/mk-glitches.php
http://www.mksecrets.net/mk3/eng/mk3-glitches.php
http://www.mksecrets.net/umk3/eng/umk3-glitches.php

Quote:
Rather than condemn all MK versions excepting for the arcade ones you should point the virtues and individualities on each one of them, because the arcade is broken too you know, it's more than enought to say "But of course this version is no match for the original arcade, in terms of graphics and gamplay."


Thats not true. MAT: DE, MK2 PS3, UMK3 360, UMK3 PS2, MK3 DOS, MKT PSX/PC and etc are all great ports. Sorry but i just dont think the sega genesis versions are good for competetive play.

Quote:
Really... the kollumns judgement should take a very different direction, after all not too many people would play old MKs, not even the arcade ones, so dismissing all versions you're doing nothing to be honest is like chopping a little bit of the MK universe.


Agree, i will try to be more positive in the next reviews, you are not the only person who tell me this lol

Quote:
It is good to remind it is not fare to compare those games with their arcade counterparts, take in consideration the capability of the system, and other fighting games released for that console around the time... and how many good fighters were for the console. The comparison looks to me like: if you are gonna get ony ONE version of this MK... go for the arcade version and never look to any other version...! while you could just say: "Hey this tiny version has its fun... you can do this and that and the other...


True, read my previous comment.

Quote:
The censored fatalities are in my opinion minimized to the point the code is needed to have real fun... and I think MK1 (gen) had 2 Fatalities for various chars...!!! it's a different point of view that might interest the fans... also the secret switches who's use have not been discovered yet... Reptile throwing a green ice blast and spear...


Which use of the switches for Genesis is not discovered? Thats only for the PC MK1 and MK2 as far as i know.

Quote:
The way you said the difference in gameplay are also covered as "terrible" mistakes wich ruin the experience... once more I ask you to check the audience you're doing this for... to me in MK1 I could do a lot more juggles, than in the original final version of MK1.


Correct, but i'm a competetive player, and i always look the to the final version of the game. Again, i may not be right to use that point of view.

Quote:
Instead of saying it's broken, you could say it had different possibilities. After all in the arcade version Sonya had an infinite Leg Grab...! so what's the criticism about any infinites the home version might have?


Sonya has that infinite in all "normal" ports too.

Quote:
People have seen your videos, and they like infinites... as for today old 2D MKs are an anecdote for most people, so they're interested in kombos, and possibilities, cool details... for example Shang Tsung could morph in Reptile in MK1... and that's cool...! If you're gonna say Tsung can do that, you dont say: "They didn't check well their programming and Tsung can morph in a green ninja, but he doesn't do all the moves, is just a green ninja and the pallete is not accurate to the arcade version, and besides you can't control it, Tsung's AI is not good either so... bad game" You could say instead: "This version features an extra morph for Shang Tsung... the elusive Reptile, and you would be lucky to see him do this morph as he only does it on rare occations...!"


I never knew about Shang morphing into Reptile in Genesis version. More info about that would be cool.

Quote:
Other example: "Tsung's Palace is gold exclusively in this version...! remember Kano's entered the tournament because he believed that Shang Tsung's palace was made of gold..? well this version has a golden version of Tsung's palace...!"


Where you got that info from?

Quote:
And for UMK3 you could mention the existence of Chameleon who latter appeared in MKT, and it is accesible through codes... it is an unfinished character, but it is always good to see the origin of one of the most enigmatic characters of MK. Aparently Chameleon was planned for the domestic versions of UMK3 but canceled due to the usual reasons of time.


Check this: http://www.mksecrets.net/umk3/eng/umk3-development.php

Quote:
MK3 horrible gameplay should be mentioned, people should know they're gonna have a headache even to pull an air kick follow by Kabal's Plasma Blast... Cyrax's throw doesn't change sides with the opponent and there're alternative commands for all special moves that requires to be holding a button, for the mercy, and for all F,F or B,B moves... if you want me to, I might do a research for some of those alternative commands. The MK3 version is REALLY bad in terms of juggles because of the gravity and velocity (maybe) and that must be explained, but other aspects that make this version unique must be presented.


Yes, the input in MK3 Genesis for some reason is horrible, i mentioned that, just didnt get into details. Still you can add stuff and i will put it in the review eventualy.

Quote:
I think the goal should be to interest people in MK... like "Hey...! that's cool, I'm gonna give it a try" then they can download the game and play it. Not making a continuos propaganda to the arcade version while bashing every other version, specially the old ones.


As i said before, you are right that i trash some of the ports too much. I will try to "fix" that in the next reviews :)

Thanks for your comments and if you have anything to add for any of the columns written, dont worry and post it.


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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 3:52 am 
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- Tsung morphs into Reptile in Genesis...
- I don't remember were did I got this believe of Kano, it might have been from a comic book... but if the source is not found it doesn't matter, it was just to ilustrate how I think the stuff should be featured to be more eye candy.

Well... for example the GB versions... you should compare them to each other, and stablish MK2 is the best one and it's fun to play, interesting, full of secrets and in general it is a lot better than the previous one.

To learn MK2 is actually fun you must compare it to Primal Rage, Toshinden, Street Fighter and Killer Instinct portable versions... the greatest ones out there, not to the original arcade port. So, it is not better than KI... but it is still good, it is enjoyable, the crappy infinites add some fun to the game along with the fatality bugs and hidden characters.

I would like to think of the kollumns as a tool to "sell" MK and increase the number of fans, not telling lies, but not being the most demanding critic MK could possibly face :lol:

MK1 Gen is fun... as well as MK2 and UMK3... MK3 gen is fun, just that juggles are almost disabled because of the gameplay "but" it has some interesting stuff you CANNOT find in any other port, so give it a try...!

When talking about genesis for example, you must realize people wont read your kollumn to see if the port is good to make a tournament or anything like that, they just wanna know if the game is "fun" in comparison with other Genesis games... you know, to download the game and emulate it on their computers... and probably play alone for a while.

UMK3 is easily one of the best fighters ever for Genesis you know...

To resume what I'm trying to say is... the kollumns should be (in my opinion) a very interesting document about all the original stuff certain port has, the most interesting details, bugs, possibilities and even codes in cases like MK1 (GB) extra characters and UMK3 (Gen) Chameleon, it doesn't matter if this information is in the codes or bug place, if it's REALLY interesting it should be mentioned in here, like a list of reasons of why that port deserves an article.

If it's MK Advance you can say is the worst portable MK for GBA... but also say "you can hit the opponent while freezing him without unfreezing them"... and there're exclusive friendships and you can run backwards, you have infinite run and stuff... so people know the game really sucks, but you also pointed a lot of interesting stuff about the game.

So at the end of the day I think it would be cool if people would say... "mmm interesting, never heard about errr... Goro being selectable in GB... gotta give it a try" and those people would come back to keep reading the kollumns in hopes to find more interesting information about MK.

So I think you might use the word "fun" for certain games not intended for competitive serious gameplay, but still deserving to be played... for example:

"If you're into MK and still like old jewels you gotta try this game, not intended to be taken too seriously but still fun"


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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 4:09 am 
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Quote:
To resume what I'm trying to say is... the kollumns should be (in my opinion) a very interesting document about all the original stuff certain port has, the most interesting details, bugs, possibilities and even codes in cases like MK1 (GB) extra characters and UMK3 (Gen) Chameleon, it doesn't matter if this information is in the codes or bug place, if it's REALLY interesting it should be mentioned in here, like a list of reasons of why that port deserves an article.

If it's MK Advance you can say is the worst portable MK for GBA... but also say "you can hit the opponent while freezing him without unfreezing them"... and there're exclusive friendships and you can run backwards, you have infinite run and stuff... so people know the game really sucks, but you also pointed a lot of interesting stuff about the game.


Main goal of the Kombat Kolumns is not to repeat the content of the website, because most of this stuff is already in the section of the game, but to expand it in a way, that was never done before.

If we start listing every single detail about a certain game no one will ever get to the end of the article and most of all we will never get to finish the article. But as mentioned above, point taken.

There are some pretty interesting things that we have planed and I hope that you will enjoy them.

The Kombat Kolumns section is only starting and I am sure that we will learn in time to write even greater thing (with your help and constructive criticism of course) :)

We might even write a Kolumn about the 10 best secrets in the Mortal Kombat Universe some day, you never know.

But the time simply do not allow us to incorporate everything in a single article.

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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 4:23 am 
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Quote:
We might even write a Kolumn about the 10 best secrets in the Mortal Kombat Universe some day, you never know.


I already know excactly what i am gonna put there :D


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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 6:35 pm 
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I fixed some minor errors in the MK3 part of last kullumn:
------------------------------------------------------
Mortal Kombat 3 for Genesis was in my opinion, better than the SNES version. Well you got the duck punch now (D + LP) but it seems that the game was not tested enough and the pushback in corner was not activated after this hit. So, what that means is that everyone has an infinite in corner just using duck punches. Almost everything that works in the original works here too, plus many broken things. Some special moves and fireballs are harder to perform in part because the game is faster than the arcade version. The sound was not good. The poor quality of the sound and the graphics is really noticeable in the version. The Lost stage where you fight against Smoke and the Graveyard arenas are missing. Jax disappears in a fire explosion and then smashes you with his giant foot during his second Fatality instead of growing, Stryker's Friendship uses dogs instead of characters, Liu Kang's arcade machine smash Fatality uses MK2 and not MK1 machine. Another interesting difference in this home version is that some of the special moves have alternative key combinations. For example Kabal's Plasma Blast... instead B, B + HP you could execute the following: hold B, press any button twice, then HP (example Hold B, RN, RN, HP). This technique works with all special moves or finishing techinques which execution includes B, B or F, F. Special Moves that requires to hold a button could be performed by tapping two arrows in any order and LK (for example F, F or U, B or F, B, or U, U or B, D all combinations will work, also this inputs can be executed by holding an arrow and pressing other buttons as explained before). A lot of kodes and cheats were added too in order to make the fun last longer: unlike in the original arcade version, you can play with the bosses in this version.
------------------------------------------------------
- Kabal's example have been changed
- Both alternative commands system have been fully explained
- The part you cannot enjoy with the bosses because of the crappy gameplay have been ommited.
- Cyrax's throw detail works good in this version... sorry I was wrong.
- Some other changes...
------------------------------------------------------
There was something about the graphics and the sound I think should be considered here... the sound and graphics... I think they were pretty good for the console, don't know if I'm wrong here... if the graphics and sounds are normal for the console then it should say something like "Graphics and sounds cannot be compared to the arcade version, but were pretty good/standart for the console... or... making a comparison between this and the SNES version as far as graphics and sounds would be good.

I mean this part of the text:

"The sound was not good. The poor quality of the sound and the graphics is really noticeable in the version."

It makes look the game pretty trashy... and I dont think it was the case at the time, and taking in consideration at the time consoles were always a lot inferior than arcades.

Just imagine you're a movie critic... and you have to comment on Star Wars... the old original movie, you gotta take in consideration it is an old movie right...? the circunstances of the times...


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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 1:34 am 
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Since I edited some of the parts you mentioned, I will respond here, because everything has its bounds. I really appreciate your critic and we will take it into consideration, but:

- Shao Kahn freezes while you play with him, so this kind of ruins the fun, don't you think.

About the sound and the graphics:

I took the capabilities of Sega Genesis into consideration when I was editing the kolumn. And ded_ is right, the sound and the graphics of MK3 are really poor, when compared to those of MKII on the same console. And that is what it says. I mean the graphics and the sound of all those versions are bad, but this is highly noticeably in MK3.

Since this is ded_'s article I will let him decide whether he wants to change something or not, after all that's him kolumn and it is his opinion that is hidden behind the text.

I just like you love MK3 for Sega Genesis, but...
I actually had the chance to play Ultimate Mortal Kombat 3 on the console first. And when I got my hands on MK3, I was like "What the ... is going on, something is not right here".

We cannot say that the game is alright, when it obviously isn't.
Only because we are an MK devoted website, does not mean that we have to like every single thing that gets released. That is so not the point.

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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 12:09 pm 
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Point taken... and you're right...!

But there're still some other stuff edited there like the alternative command systems, and it's not a love for MK3 GEN but rather for all that is MK...!

I know the game is totally horrible :lol:

But I do love MK1 Gen and UMK3 Gen :D I think they're terrific...!

I was just focusing in MK3 because ded_ and I were chating about it and I felt like helping (putting my nose were nobody were calling me :shock: anyways...)


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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 12:55 pm 
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We asked for the feedback, and I am happy that we received feedback.

Your comments brought up some interesting things that will definitely help us on the future development of the section.

I only hope that soon more visitors will join us in this discussion.

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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 5:15 pm 
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When informing there is a new kollumn make sure to ask for comments (I know you do that already), and say were to click to comment and stuff... most people don't see they can post a comment about the subject...

Another problem is people must register in the forum to leave a comment, so there might be people willing to leave a comment but when the registration stuff appears they just close the window.

In MKWarehouse people can leave a comment without than problem...

Just saying... not for me because I have an account...


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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 5:48 pm 
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We used to allow this too, but allowing guests to post leads to a lot of spam.

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 Post subject: Re: Site Update: Kombat Kolumns Issue 07
 Post Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 6:02 pm 
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true, and the registration imo is not that hard to make


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